Discussion:
[rescue] Sun2: Looking for the 1.X Boot PROMs
Steve Piette
2018-04-10 18:20:53 UTC
Permalink
Anyone have the 1.X.X version of the Sun2 boot PROMs that came out
with/after 4.0? I have the Rev N and Rev R PROMs.

Steve
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Michael Thompson
2018-04-11 17:27:34 UTC
Permalink
Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2018 13:20:53 -0500
Subject: [rescue] Sun2: Looking for the 1.X Boot PROMs
Anyone have the 1.X.X version of the Sun2 boot PROMs that came out
with/after 4.0? I have the Rev N and Rev R PROMs.
Steve
I think that mine have the R ROMs.
I have seen Q ROMs, but nothing newer than R.
--
Michael Thompson
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Earl Baugh
2018-04-12 17:31:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Michael Thompson
Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2018 13:20:53 -0500
Subject: [rescue] Sun2: Looking for the 1.X Boot PROMs
Anyone have the 1.X.X version of the Sun2 boot PROMs that came out
with/after 4.0? I have the Rev N and Rev R PROMs.
Steve
I think that mine have the R ROMs.
I have seen Q ROMs, but nothing newer than R.
--
Michael Thompson
Are you looking for the Sun 2/120 board PROMS? (wasn't sure which Sun 2 you
were talking about)

Earl
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Steve Piette
2018-04-13 03:24:53 UTC
Permalink
*
*
Post by Michael Thompson
I think that mine have the R ROMs.
I have seen Q ROMs, but nothing newer than R.
--
Michael Thompson
Are you looking for the Sun 2/120 board PROMS? (wasn't sure which Sun 2 you
were talking about)
Earl
Yes,

I'm looking for the last version of the 2/1XX Multibus CPU boot PROMs.
The SunOS 4.0 documentation mentions distributing them and I've seen
references for a 1.1.2 version but don't know which CPU type they were
from or find a copy.

I seem to have two different versions of the Rev N PROMs and the Rev R
PROMs.

Sun Workstation, Model Sun-1/100U or Sun-1/150U, VT100 keyboard
ROM Rev N, 1MB memory installed

Sun Workstation, Model Sun-2/120 or Sun-2/170, Sun-2 keyboard
ROM Rev N, 1MB memory installed

Sun Workstation, Model Sun-2/120 or Sun-2/170, Sun-2 keyboard
ROM Rev R, 4MB memory installed

I've seen Rev Q but those only seem to be on VME Sun 2's like the 2/50.

I finally have a system up and running that I can clone but there have
been pops, bangs, and magic smoke released getting there.

Steve
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Stefan Skoglund
2018-04-13 17:55:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve Piette
*
*
Post by Michael Thompson
I think that mine have the R ROMs.
I have seen Q ROMs, but nothing newer than R.
--
Michael Thompson
Are you looking for the Sun 2/120 board PROMS? (wasn't sure which Sun 2 you
were talking about)
Earl
Yes,
I'm looking for the last version of the 2/1XX Multibus CPU boot PROMs.
The SunOS 4.0 documentation mentions distributing them and I've seen
references for a 1.1.2 version but don't know which CPU type they were
from or find a copy.
I seem to have two different versions of the Rev N PROMs and the Rev R
PRO
Sun Workstation, Model Sun-2/120 or Sun-2/170, Sun-2 keyboard
ROM Rev N, 1MB memory installed
Sun Workstation, Model Sun-2/120 or Sun-2/170, Sun-2 keyboard
ROM Rev R, 4MB memory installed
I've seen Rev Q but those only seem to be on VME Sun 2's like the 2/50.
What is the differences between the different versions ?
Is it support for extra memory or other boot devices ?
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Steve Piette
2018-04-15 03:06:03 UTC
Permalink
/
/>/ Yes,
/>/
/>/ I'm looking for the last version of the 2/1XX Multibus CPU boot/ /PROMs.
/>/ The SunOS 4.0 documentation mentions distributing them and I've seen
/>/ references for a 1.1.2 version but don't know which CPU type they
/>/ were //from or find a copy.
/>/
/
What is the differences between the different versions ?
Is it support for extra memory or other boot devices ?
What's different is part of why I'm attempting to track them down.

There was only a short comment in the documentation (which I now can't
find to quote)
and a few references that they exist dug up searching Google and various
old archives.

I'm hoping they might add some of the features that Sun 3's got like
extended diags and perhaps QIC24 support at that time.

--
Steve
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Jon
2018-04-15 08:26:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve Piette
What's different is part of why I'm attempting to track them down.
There was only a short comment in the documentation (which I now can't
find to quote)
and a few references that they exist dug up searching Google and various
old archives.
I'm hoping they might add some of the features that Sun 3's got like
extended diags and perhaps QIC24 support at that time.
The biggest change is the switch from ND boot to TFTP boot so that sun-2s
can work in natively in NFS-based networks.

The new sun-2 PROMs are described in document 800-1736-10A.
It doesn't mention QIC24, but there is an extended test sequence.

I'd be interested in a copy if you happen to track down one of these newer
PROMs. The extended tests might prove quite useful.

- Jon
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Steve Piette
2018-04-16 02:14:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jon
The biggest change is the switch from ND boot to TFTP boot so that sun-2s
can work in natively in NFS-based networks.
The new sun-2 PROMs are described in document 800-1736-10A.
It doesn't mention QIC24, but there is an extended test sequence.
I'd be interested in a copy if you happen to track down one of these newer
PROMs. The extended tests might prove quite useful.
- Jon
Thanks for the pointer, I'd forgotten there was a whole section of the
changes in the PROM Users Manual.

I'll be happy to share whatever I find.

--
Steve
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Earl Baugh
2018-04-17 19:50:47 UTC
Permalink
Date: Fri, 13 Apr 2018 19:55:22 +0200
Subject: Re: [rescue] Sun2: Looking for the 1.X Boot PROMs
Post by Steve Piette
*
*
Post by Michael Thompson
I think that mine have the R ROMs.
I have seen Q ROMs, but nothing newer than R.
--
Michael Thompson
Are you looking for the Sun 2/120 board PROMS? (wasn't sure which
Sun 2 you
were talking about)
Earl
Yes,
I'm looking for the last version of the 2/1XX Multibus CPU boot
PROMs.
The SunOS 4.0 documentation mentions distributing them and I've seen
references for a 1.1.2 version but don't know which CPU type they
were
from or find a copy.
I seem to have two different versions of the Rev N PROMs and the Rev
R
PRO
Sun Workstation, Model Sun-2/120 or Sun-2/170, Sun-2 keyboard
ROM Rev N, 1MB memory installed
Sun Workstation, Model Sun-2/120 or Sun-2/170, Sun-2 keyboard
ROM Rev R, 4MB memory installed
I've seen Rev Q but those only seem to be on VME Sun 2's like the
2/50.
What is the differences between the different versions ?
Is it support for extra memory or other boot devices
I have a number of Sun 2 boards... I'll have to check the PROMs.
I'm pretty sure they're not all the same... What images are on-line?
(I also have to read my Sun 1 PROMs since I have the only original ones...
so maybe
test with the Sun 2 ones...)


Earl
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Steve Piette
2018-04-20 15:54:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Earl Baugh
I have a number of Sun 2 boards... I'll have to check the PROMs.
I'm pretty sure they're not all the same... What images are on-line?
(I also have to read my Sun 1 PROMs since I have the only original ones...
so maybe
test with the Sun 2 ones...)
Earl
Right now I believe that only a copy of the Rev R PROMs is online. I
found it as part of the TME archives for emulating a Sun2. It's a
combined 16 bit image where the actual board uses even and odd PROMs
marked 0 and 8 (LSB of each PROM).

I have at least three different versions that I'll be putting up as soon
as I fix my EPROM programmer.
I also have some SCSI2SD bootable images I've built. Having something
you can boot from seems to be the biggest issue people face with these
old machines due to the problems with both distribution media and
working drives to read with.

Steve
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Mouse
2018-04-20 16:02:56 UTC
Permalink
[...Sun-2s...]
Having something you can boot from seems to be the biggest issue
people face with these old machines due to the problems with both
distribution media and working drives to read with.
Couldn't Sun-2s netboot? Or is your "something" talking about
software for those who want to run SunOS?

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Dave McGuire
2018-04-20 16:12:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mouse
[...Sun-2s...]
Having something you can boot from seems to be the biggest issue
people face with these old machines due to the problems with both
distribution media and working drives to read with.
Couldn't Sun-2s netboot? Or is your "something" talking about
software for those who want to run SunOS?
Earlier boot ROMs could only netboot via the ND protocol. That's one
reason people are looking for the later ROMs.

(I'm interested in the later ROMs as well.)

-Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
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Mouse
2018-04-20 16:42:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dave McGuire
Post by Mouse
Couldn't Sun-2s netboot?
Earlier boot ROMs could only netboot via the ND protocol.
I believe there are open implementations of ND; NetBSD has had ndbootd
since at least 4.0.1 and probably earlier. (While admittedly it's not
ideal, it may be easier for many than finding new ROM images.)

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Stefan Skoglund
2018-04-20 18:01:21 UTC
Permalink
Does it matter if ndbootd runs in a VM? it shouldnt... but.
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Josh Dersch
2018-04-21 18:01:31 UTC
Permalink
Hi,
Duh, Rev R was the version that was already known. I misread that part.
Anyway I can confirm that you can set up a NetBSD box with ndbootd from
Matt
Fredette and the Sun2 will boot from it using network disk (ND) for
fetching
the kernel and then NFS as usual, see
Loading Image...
<https://giga.nl/walter/computers/sun2_boot.gif>
This is my Sun 2/50, apparantly it has the Rev Q ROM. It is somewhere hard
to
reach, when I get the time Ib ll read those ROMs as well and add them to
the
tar file.
Not that this helps the original poster, but my Sun-2/150 came with Rev M
PROMs, I've dumped them here for posterity:

http://yahozna.dyndns.org/scratch/sun2/proms/

(I also stashed a ton of early docs I scanned at
http://yahozna.dyndns.org/scratch/sun/)

- Josh
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Jason T
2018-04-22 23:36:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Josh Dersch
(I also stashed a ton of early docs I scanned at
http://yahozna.dyndns.org/scratch/sun/)
Josh - if you don't mind, I'll incorporate your scans into my archive
at http://chiclassiccomp.org/docs/index.php?dir=%2Fcomputing/Sun

-j
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Steve Piette
2018-04-26 04:13:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Josh Dersch
Not that this helps the original poster, but my Sun-2/150 came with Rev M
http://yahozna.dyndns.org/scratch/sun2/proms/
(I also stashed a ton of early docs I scanned at
http://yahozna.dyndns.org/scratch/sun/)
- Josh
Thanks Josh,

I've added yours to my collection.

No luck from any of my other channels so far locating the later EPROMs.

Steve
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Steve Piette
2018-04-26 04:55:11 UTC
Permalink
Hi,
I have a Sun2 CPU board that I cannot test. It's a 501-1007. The EPROMs have
been replaced somewhere along the way, the stickers on them are handwritten.
They say 520-1101-03. I have read the content of them.
Could this be the sought after Rev R?
I also have a Sun 1.5 CPU board, part number 501-0600. While I was at
it, I've also read out the EPROMs in here. This system was rebadged by
German manufacturer KONTRON, which clearly shows in the ROM content.
Get all the images here: https://giga.nl/walter/computers/sun2-roms.tgz
<https://giga.nl/walter/computers/sun2-roms.tgz>
Cheers,
Walter.
Thank you Walter,

Everything earlier than the Rev R 520-1101-03/520-1102-03 that I have
are handwritten and I have both handwritten and printed labels Rev R
versions.

In my search I talked with John Gilmore to see if he had any leads but
the "new" PROMs post-date his tenure.

Steve
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Steve Piette
2018-05-09 17:18:40 UTC
Permalink
Anyone have the 1.X.X version of the Sun2 boot PROMs that came out with/after 4.0? I have the Rev N and Rev R PROMs.
Just tonight I came into possession of a basket case 2/120 as a disassembled
pile of parts. I have two CPU boards. Thanks to the help of a few friends, one
has been identified as Rev N, and the other as Rev 1.0f. They are imaged
<https://diskfutility.com/files/sun/rom/Sun2-120-revN-IC1.BIN>
<https://diskfutility.com/files/sun/rom/Sun2-120-revN-IC2.BIN>
<https://diskfutility.com/files/sun/rom/Sun2-120-rev1.0f-IC1.BIN>
<https://diskfutility.com/files/sun/rom/Sun2-120-rev1.0f-IC2.BIN>
IC2 is the chip nearest the CPU. Hopefully this is helpful to someone.
Best regards,
Ryan
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The rev N images look like the standard version for the Sun-2 keyboard
but the rev 1.0f look like it may be a winner. I'll try burning a couple
of 27256 EPROMs and see if it boots up and what it says it is.

Thanks,

Steve
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Steve Piette
2018-05-27 15:58:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve Piette
Post by Steve Piette
Anyone have the 1.X.X version of the Sun2 boot PROMs that came out
with/after 4.0? I have the Rev N and Rev R PROMs.
Just tonight I came into possession of a basket case 2/120 as a disassembled
pile of parts. I have two CPU boards. Thanks to the help of a few friends, one
has been identified as Rev N, and the other as Rev 1.0f. They are imaged
<https://diskfutility.com/files/sun/rom/Sun2-120-rev1.0f-IC1.BIN>
<https://diskfutility.com/files/sun/rom/Sun2-120-rev1.0f-IC2.BIN>
The rev N images look like the standard version for the Sun-2 keyboard
but the rev 1.0f look like it may be a winner. I'll try burning a
couple of 27256 EPROMs and see if it boots up and what it says it is.
It took a little longer to get the EPROM burner working than I planned
but it's done, burned the 1.0f images to 27C256, moved J400 from 1-2 to
2-3 for the 256 chips. Here's the result using a Sun-2 Prime CPU board
that was running Rev R before the swap:

Self Test completed successfully.

Sun Workstation, Model Sun-2/120 or Sun-2/170, Sun-2 keyboard
ROM Rev 1.0f, 5MB memory installed
Serial #XXXX, Ethernet address 8:0:20:XX:XX:XX

Using RS232 A input.
Auto-boot in progress...
Abort at EF5146
Post by Steve Piette
h
Boot PROM Monitor Commands Description Help Table

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
a [digit] | Open CPU Address Regs (0-7)
b [dev([cntrl],[unit],[part])] | Boot a file
c [addr] | Continue program at this address
d [digit] | Open CPU Data Regs (0-7)
e [addr] | Open address as a 16 bit word
f start_addr end_addr pattern [size] | Fill Memory
g [addr] | Go to this address
h | Display Help Menu
k [number] | Reset (0)CPU, (1)MMU, (2)System
l [addr] | Open address as a 32 bit long word
m [addr] | Open Segment Map
o [addr] | Open address as a 8 bit byte
p [addr] | Open Page Map
q [addr] | Open EEPROM
r | Open CPU Regs (i.e. PC, SR)
s [digit] | Set or query Function Code (0-7)
t [y/n/c] | Trace: Yes/No/Continuous
u [argument] | Use different console devices
v start_addr end_addr [size] | Display Memory
x | Extended Diagnostic Tests
z [addr] | Set a Breakpoint
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Post by Steve Piette
x
Using RS232 A input.


Extended Test Menu: (Enter 'q' to return to Monitor)

Cmd - Test

kb - Keyboard Input Test
me - Memory Test
vi - Video Test
mk - Mouse/Keyboard Ports Test
rs - Serial Ports Test
ec - 3Com Ethernet Bootpath Test
ar - Archieve Tape Bootpath Test
be - Ethernet Bootpath Test
mt - TapeMaster Bootpath Test
sd - SCSI Disk Bootpath Test
st - SCSI Tape Bootpath Test
xt - Xylogics Tape Bootpath Test
xy - Xylogics 450/451 Disk Bootpath Test

Cmd=>me

Memory Tests: (Enter 'q' to return to Test Menu)

Enter Cmd [low addr > 0x2000] [hi addr < 0x4FFFFF] [hex pattern]

Cmd - Test

a - Address Test
c - Wr/Rd Pattern Test
r - Read/compare Pattern Test
s - Scan Memory Test
w - Write Pattern Test

Cmd=>s

Test Options: (Enter 'q' to return to Test Menu)

Cmd - Option

f - Loop forever
h - Loop forever with Halt on error
l - Loop once with Loop on error
n - Loop forever with error messages inhibited
<cr> - Loop once

Cmd=>


Memory test from address [0x2000 - 0x4FFFFF].

Test passed during pass 1. Total errors = 0.

Memory Tests: (Enter 'q' to return to Test Menu)


While there may still be a later (newer) revision, this works great.

Thank you Ryan!

Steve
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